Ask Brother Steve
If there's something you want to know that isn't covered in the site, . I will reply, and if I think the answer may be useful to others, I'll post it here. (Give me a few days, please!)
Q. Not lifting a finger. Thank you so much for the site - it is by far the best resource I have found on the web for beginning whistlers such as myself. I have a quick question on the "Not Lifting a Finger" section. I began teaching myself this style after thinking about the economy and mechanics of motion on the whistle. I think it's a great style, especially for improving speed and accuracy - as well as eliminating what appears to be the awkward use of the little finger as a brace. However, I was recently criticized for this - the person stating that keeping fingers down, while not necessarily affecting pitch, will impact tone. I was hoping to get your thoughts on this. I'm a newbie and want to approach technique properly.
Bill
Hello Bill,
I haven't noticed any effect on tone from "lazy fingering" - except on second octave D, where you will get a slightly brighter sound by venting the first hole. But the difference is very slight, and mainly to our own ears, I think, since they are so close to that open hole. The effect on tone for a listener is pretty negligible.
All the same, I suppose I might choose to vent that hole if I were playing a slow air, or for the last note of a tune. But at dance tune speed? Not an issue at all.
On other notes, I don't think there is any issue. Although it might depend on the whistle you are playing I suppose - fancy modern "maker's" whistles may behave somewhat differently from the old cheapies I prefer. If - and I repeat, if - you notice differences with your whistle, then it's your call.
If you were to move on to the simple-system wooden flute, some of these lazy fingerings may not be such a good idea. I don't really know, I don't play the flute. But nothing to stop you from using different techniques on flute and whistle. (You have to anyway - embouchure, grip, hand position, breathing use of tonguing and so on.)
On the other hand, you can rest assured that plenty of good trad. whistle players use the fingerings I talk about. If anybody made the comment to me that they made to you, I would smile politely (if I were in a good mood) and mentally tell them to take a hike.
But that's me. As in every field of learning - don't follow advice blindly. Test out what people recommend or advise against, and decide what works for yourself. It's folk music, after all!
Cheers, Steve
Q. Biting the mouthpiece. Is it wrong to bite down lightly on the mouthpiece of the whiste to help steady it? This is something which feels very natural to me. I've been playing for about 6 months and I'm happy with my progress but I recently read in a whistle tutor book that gripping the mouthpiece with the teeth is to be avoided. The book didn't say why.
I see how - bearing in mind the advice you give on "lazy" fingerings for C# - one would never necessarily need to use this method to steady the instrument, but it simply feels natural to me and I can't think of any good reason not to do it.
However, I don't want to grow too attached to a bad habit, if indeed it is one. Any thoughts on this? Love the site.
Eoin
Hi Eoin,
I suppose I would say biting was a bad habit, although you may be in good company. Colin Goldie, who makes Overton whistles, told me about one very prominent professional player who practically chews through the mouthpieces of the whistles that Colin makes - and these are aluminium whistles! Not very good for the teeth, as well as the rest of your system!
I've never done it, and I wouldn't want my whistles looking all chewed up. I also wonder whether the constant little shocks from your fingers hitting the whistle might not loosen your teeth over a period of years. And seriously, if you are biting hard, the TMJ (temporo-mandibular joint - where your jaw is attached, basically) is a very delicate part of your body that's important for balance and general health - I think it would be best to avoid stressing it.
Most people manage fine without doing this and without dropping the whistle! I use the third finger of my bottom hand for balance when needed. (I don't believe that keeping your little finger on the whistle all the time, as recommended by some teachers, is a good idea.)
But it's up to you. There are always people who do things "wrong" and are brilliant players, like the man I mentioned above. Your call!
Best, Steve
Q. Sliding. Completely enjoying your site. When I hear a flute with a "sliding note" sound, is that the Tin Whistle? And how is it done?
Regards, Craig
Hi Craig,
It could well be! Although you can also slide notes on other simple system transverse flutes, such as the wooden "concert" flutes used in Irish and other Celtic music.
I wrote some tjps on how to do it on the whistle on this page.
Regards, Steve
Q. Flat notes. Steve, Thanks so much. I went out and bought a low cost tin whistle for my 12 year old daughter and she is playing it beautifully in 24 hours. God's gift. Love your material, thanks again.
I do have one question. It's about tuning. This little whistle seems
to be flat on "some" notes and not on others. Does a more expensive instrument solve that, I know with guitars it's the same problem?
Regards, Craig
Hello again Craig,
Great to hear about your daughter taking to the whistle like a duck to water.
The cheap old whistles do have their tuning idiosyncracies, for sure. For example F# tends to be a few cents flat and the B is often a wee bit sharp. The F# is deliberate, I think, it gives you a sort of untempered major third which actually sounds sweeter than what you get on a piano, and is nice for solo playing. The B I think is the result of a compromise of trying to get other notes in some sort of tune, like the C# and cross-fingered C natural.
But to an extent it's a question of learning to blow the whistle into tune. For instance you need to be pretty assertive with your blowing in the higher range of the second octave, otherwise notes tend to be flat.
But it's sometimes a bit of a crapshoot playing with other instruments! More expensive whistles are often tuned more carefully to equal temperament, but still you need to learn how to blow every whistle I think. I like the cheapies best - I play one in a band with lots of other instruments, no problems - but I have a couple of more expensive ones in case the tuning becomes an issue with other players.
Cheers, Steve
Q. Cleaning the mouthpiece. I started learning to play tin whistle a few months ago. Just a simple question, how do you clean the whistle? Especially the mouthpiece? I went around to look for a milk-bottle brush but could not find anything suitable. Is this the normal practice? Sometimes, the mouth piece smells. Any tips to keep the tin whistle clean and smelling fresh?
Ben
Hi Ben,
That's an unusual question! It's true, "stuff" (I don't want to know what it is) accumulates in the windway sometimes. If the head of your whistle is of plastic or metal (not wood) you could soak the head in soapy water. Then cut up a credit card and push it through the windway to remove the gunk. (This will achieve two goals - keeping your spending under control and keeping your whistle clean!)
As for the smell, how about using a nice pure Castile soap for the soaking process? I like Dr. Bronner's peppermint.... non-toxic. When the solution dries the soap will also act as a surfactant, helping to prevent the accumulation of ... whatever it is.
It the whistle is of wood, try threading a fine piece of cloth through the windway. A drop of sweet almond oil on the cloth will be good for the wood.
Hope this helps, Steve
Q. Really high notes. Are there any tricks to playing really high notes -the third octave of D playable on a D whistle and above? Is it all about wind speed? I have a brandless, non-tunable D whisle that I got at Fort Ticonderoga as a souvenir, and thought was pretty uninteresting for a good 8 years until December when I started digging into Irish and Scottish music.
Daniel.
Hi Daniel,
I can't tell you much about playing in the third octave because I never do it - I don't think I have ever used a note higher than d'' (2 octaves above the bottom note). Technically I suppose it is about wind speed but to me it just feels like blowing harder!
If you really want to damage your ears, alternative fingerings can help - if you search the net for "tinwhistle fingering charts" you should find some, such as the ones at this site: http://www.fullbodyburn.com/.
Here are some that work on my Generation and similar whistles:
Second octave
c#: as low c# i.e. [| ooo ooo ]
c-natural: [| voo ooo ] (v = halfhole), or [| oxo ooo ], or [| oxx xxo ]
Third octave
d: [| oxx ooo ] (easiest), or [| oxx xxx ], or [| xxx xxx ]
e: [| xxo ooo ]
f#: [| xoo ooo ]
There are other fingerings for these notes and indeed you can apparently go higher, if your eardrums can take it.
Steve
Q. Little finger. I am a beginner that has been playing for a week. I’ve got the Grey Larsen book and L.E. McCullough’s video tutor and am going through them. I should say that I am an experienced (trained) musician on the guitar.
The biggest sticking point so far, and burning question, is support of the instrument through anchors. Both Larsen and McCullough recommend anchoring the right pinky 100% of the time to balance the instrument and allow relaxation. The problem is that for anyone of normal hand anatomy, the pinky will not reach the whistle when in proper playing position using the pads of the fingers. In order to rest the pinky on the whistle you have to scrunch to some extent. This introduces tension into the pinky and ring finger and restricts the motion of all bottom hand fingers. You may get used to this, but any beginner should be able to report the tension that results and the restricted movement. I know many folk players on guitar use various anchors, but they are really not helpful; they only introduce restriction and tension.
You seem to take a different approach using the R ring finger to anchor C# and other “lazy” fingering tricks. This sounds like a more natural approach. Do you have any further thoughts on anchoring the instrument? Are there lots of good players out there that don’t use the pinky anchor?
Marcus
Marcus,
I don't understand why teachers insist that you have to glue your little finger to the whistle. Do whatever suits your anatomy and your inclination. You can banish any fears - if any you had - that you cannot get to be a good player without doing so.
I haven't noticed many, or in fact any, top whistle players using the pinky constantly - but then I haven't really looked all that carefully. I do know one respected whistle teacher who thinks it makes no sense to leave it there all the time, citing the lack of flexibility in the other fingers of the bottom hand that you mention.
Steve
Q. F natural. I was looking at your site trying to figure out how to play an f natural on a D flute or whistle. Could you possibly offer some pointers?
Alexander
Hi Alexander,
On a whistle, and on a flute without keys, you obtain f-natural by "half-holing", which means partially covering a hole.
Using a standard fingering diagram, this is represented as follows: [| xxx xvo
In other words only the bottom hole on your instrument (which is actually the E hole - your D hole is the open end of the whistle ) is open - shown as an o. The next hole up, the F# hole, is half covered (the v symbol). All the other holes are covered (x).
If you play with your fingertips, just cover approx. half the hole with your fingertip. If you play with the flats of the fingers, like most people, you'll probably straighten the middle finger of your bottom hand somewhat to uncover the hole partially. In either case your ear will tell you how much uncovering is enough. It'll seem very difficult at first but once you practice a bit it's surprisingly easy to play f-naturals this way and will quickly become second nature.
You use the same technique to get most other accidentals, e.g. Eb, Bb, G#, and even C-natural (which a lot of people only ever play by half-holing the top hole). C-nat and Bb, however, and sometimes G#, can often be got by cross-fingering, depending on your instrument.
Hope this helps, Steve
Q. Grace notes are not real notes. When you play, let's say a roll, do you basically try to leave the main note finger DOWN and pick up a finger above that, thereby producing a sound that really isn't a note (because fingers below it are still down)? I find myself wanting to finger ornaments like I would have played grace notes on a cello or a flute, but I get the idea that Irish ornaments aren't really going for the real pitch but for the rhythmic effect. Am I right about that?
Laurel
Dear Laurel,
You're right about the fact that the sounds aren't grace notes and not
really notes at all - just blips. I DO say all this on the website....
(read it again hehe).
They aren't notes mainly because of the speed, although the fact that lower
fingers may be down would sometimes produce a note out of the scale you're
playing in - if you let it last long enough to be able to discern the
pitch, which you don't want to do.
I say MAY be down because you can of course cut with the "main note
finger". In fact, for cutting a B, for example, you have no choice. For
other notes you do have a choice, and as I do say in the cuts section of
the site, for simplicity's sake I recommend using only the "G finger"
and the "B finger". Though of course you are free to experiment with other
possibilities.
You can't rely on training in other sorts of music to help you with this
stuff. You've just got to learn the language, which, as with any language,
you do by listening to "native speakers" (or foreigners who have an
acceptable accent, like me ;) )
Steve
Q. Whistles in different keys. I am a relatively non-musical adult who fell in with a pack of old-time music players with whom we camp twice a year. One year ago I decided to try to learn to play an instrument, and chose the pennywhistle because (unlike banjos, fiddles and suchlike) the packing would be easier, and because (ahem!) I had the notion it was pretty easy I started with a D whistle my husband made. As a Christmas present I received a pack of other whistles: F, E-flat, C, B-flat. Generation (F and B-f) the rest Susato.
And I need HELP. My main concern is that it appears from the physics of the instrument that each one needs to be fingered differently to play the same music (ie on the D whistle the low D is played with all holes stopped, on the F whistle the lowest accessible D is played with only the top hole covered, on the C whistle with only the bottom hole open.
Tamara
Dear Tamara,
The thing about the different keyed whistles is this - you really do play them all as if they were D whistles. If you attempt to use them as they are, and worry about which note is which on every whistle, you'll go mad.
My regular D whistle lets me play 85% of the Irish trad. repertoire - I can play in the following keys with it:
D major
E minor
E dorian (minor with sharpened 6th, i.e. c#)
G major
A dorian (and A minor if you can half-hole to get F-natural)
A myxolidian (A major with a flattened seventh, i.e. G-natural)
A major (if you can half-hole to get G#s)
B minor
That is really quite a range of keys. I use lower-pitched (or higher-pitched) whistles just to enjoy a different timbre playing at home. Using the _same_ fingering as on my D whistle. So if I play a D tune on a B-flat whistle, it comes out in B-flat, and who cares, I'm not playing with others.
I use other whistles occasionally to get different keys needed for Irish music. For example, on a D whistle you can't play in D minor or G minor (actually nearly always D and G dorian in Irish music).
But if I play in "E minor" (i.e. using E minor fingering) on a C whistle, it comes out in D minor. Same for G minor - play in A minor on a C whistle. Now I can play along with the fiddlers.
You could make a chart showing what keys the list I gave above would give on different whistles, which would be a useful reference maybe. I should put one on the website...
I hope this makes sense and will help you.
Steve
Q. Horrible sound. Hi Brother Steve,
Went to the Highland Games yesterday and picked up Feadog's Orginal Irish Whistle Kit. I get a little un-nerved when this whistle makes the most horrible sound I have ever heard! What causes that? At times the sound is really neat, then again - it is worse than horrible! Does the 'cheapness' of the whistle cause this noise, or is it me?
Marsha
Hi Marsha
Horrible sound - well it could be the whistle. Not because it's cheap - I generally play cheap whistles most of the time - but because it might be a bad one.
On the other hand it could very well be you! Most beginners blow far too hard when they start the whistle. To get the lower octave you need soft breath, esp. for the lowest note. Imagine blowing a candle enough to
just make the flame flicker a bit.
You need more breath to get into the higher octave. Try using less breath and if it really still sounds horrible, try a different whistle.
Another problem though is getting your fingers to seal the holes properly. If the holes aren't completely covered you will get squawks and squeaks. I recommend playing not with the fingertips but with the
flats of your fingers - keep your fingers fairly straight and relaxed and let the pads cover the holes.
My site isn't aimed at total beginners and doesn't deal with the rudiments of whistle playing. To get the most out of it you need to pick up the basics first.
Here's are a few sites that might be useful :
Chiff & Fipple is a huge sprawling site with lots and lots of information. It also has a message forum where you can ask all kinds of questions and get very helpful advice. Some of it conflicting! The only caution I would give you is that many of the people who post there are into collecting expensive whistles and look down on the cheap
ones. A lot of the people who think like this don't play very well, and many of the world's top players are quite happy to play in concert and on CD with $10 whistles, so don't get sucked into thinking you have to
spend money to get a nice sound.
There is a tutorial at sessioneer.org - it might have some
useful hints. But there are no sound clips.
I'd suggest you get a good tutor book such as the Clarke tinwhistle book
and CD by Bill Ochs.
All the best, Steve
Q. Minor scales and modes in Irish music. Recently I decided to learn - try to - the low whistle. But I couldn't figure at all what was wrong with the "minor" scales in the tutorial books or wwweb sites. Finally, I found your site, read most of it and here at the end I see you write "minor" with quotes. Now the problem is you said too much or too little... So... What IS Dorian mode, now that we know what it isn't ?
Kenavo
Salut Paul,
The vast majority of "minor" tunes in the Irish tradition are in the Dorian mode. This is similar to the standard minor scale except that the sixth degree is sharpened and the seventh unsharpened. The table below sets out the notes used in the Dorian modes commonly used in Irish music on the whistle and the corresponding minor scale. The scales run from bottom to top (seemed more intuitive that way). The notes in bold type are those that differ.
E-Dorian |
E minor |
A-Dorian |
A minor |
B-Dorian |
B minor |
E |
E |
A |
A |
B |
B |
Note that E minor and B minor (with an unsharpened seventh) are the only minor scales you can get on the whistle without half-holing. You will come across B minor a fair bit - B Dorian is rare.
Hope this helps,
Steve
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Updated 23 November 2008